Wednesday, January 28, 2009

US Air Rescue Cartoon - Please discuss

Please discuss this cartoon. Be thorough. All religions, communities of faith, bodies of believers, and skeptics are welcome.
Did God intervene in the US Air jet landing and rescue operation on the Hudson river?
If God does intervene, why didn't he do something about the 25,000 or so people who died of malnutrition on the same day as this rescue?
If God intervenes, why didn't he simply intervene to save the geese?
Why are there no rescue tugboats in the cartoon?
Are we terrified to admit/affirm that we've been in an unbroken chain of cause and effect ever since The Big Bang?


Anonymous said...

Yes, "god" must be responsible for this ~ after all ~ all believers in god know it is certainly impossible for a craft (designed by man) to fly (also designed to be landed in water) to glide down on backup hydraulics and limping turbines (engineered to survive bird hits without explosion or total failure) after already traveling at flying speed and without killing everyone guided by a calm pilot. This must be proof god exists and that man is not in control of his own destiny. If god had existed, yes he probably would have moved the geese out of the way... but he didn't, which leaves man in his shadow to shred the remaining animals on earth, and finally take responsibility for it and all the other suffering that is going on instead of begging cloud people to fix it for him.

jobsanger said...

If there is a god, she had nothing to do with it. Those people all survived because they had an excellent pilot.

Gar said...

Stuff like this cartoon always make me giggle.

Even if you are super Christian you must see the irony.

It's akin to those people that survive a natural disaster and they are muddling through the rubbish that used to be their house and they are saying, "All I can say is God must have been looking out for me."

I got news for ya sister. If God was looking after you, he must have been living with me cuz I didn't even think about getting on a plane that day.

Now, I have to sit around and wait for all my God-fearing friends to send me pictures of this cartoon as proof of God's existence. They'll come, of course, complete with a midi tune of "Amazing Grace" playing in the background and swans gracefully flapping around in the front.

Who made this cartoon? It's irritating me! :)

Anonymous said...

Oh dear Whited....... I am not the 1st Anonymous!!!!!

I do believe God had a hand in the safety of that plane and it's passengers. Having an excellent pilot didn't hurt anything.

I'm a bit confused by Anon's "if God had existed", when Anon indicates in the body of text that God did indeed have a hand in their (passengers and crew) safety.

Joy said...

Watch out, people! God's gonna flip the plane over! He's right beh-

Anonymous said...

Well, let's assume God did save them. What does this tell us? First, God can use his power to intervene in this world. Second, He is very willing to do so. We cannot argue with these points; if they were false, He would not, or could not, have saved the passengers.

Ok, so God can and does save people. But some people do die in plane crashes, so obviously God chooses who he is going to save, and who is going to die. Implicit in this statement is that, according to God, some people deserve to live, while others deserve to die.

If we could make the not-so-outlandish assumption that God admits those he deems worthy to live to heaven, and sends those He wants dead to hell, then we can tell the rate at which people go to heaven by examining the rate at which people survive plane crashes.

So, to you who believe you are bound for heaven, I have one warning: I hope you like being lonely.

Procrustes said...


That's as thorough as any crap like that deserves.

I'll humor anyway:

If God is omnipotent and interventionist, nothing can occur without God's intervention. Therefore, the plane crashed because God made it crash. The geese died because God made them die. Tens of thousands of people die daily because God makes them die, and billions of other people don't die because God makes them not die.

Attribution of events to God should not be limited to the things that make us feel all yummy inside. If you really believe in an omnipotent God, you must attribute ALL to God, good or bad, and stop fucking whining about what you think is a "miracle" just because some fellow sheep survived a crash. If God exists, and is omnipotent, then EVERY FUCKING THING THAT EVER FUCKING HAPPENS is a miracle.

Some lady on the freeway died the other day when the tire of a car being towed by a towtruck miraculously loosed itself, bounced on the road, and right into the face of the blessed woman driver. It's a miracle she died.
(True story)

Jos Metadi said...

Sometimes God works miracles. Sometime He doesn't. God is not deterministic.

Not every good thing is a miracle, and not every miracle is seen as a good thing.

Bad things happen to good people and good things happen to bad people. That's why this is earth, not heaven.

Many of the bad things that happen everyday are the result of evil human decisions (the starvation deaths resulting from corrupt governments, the various genocides, regular murders, etc). Some are a result of lack of planning, laziness, and some are just plain bad luck.

From what I've seen in history, God rarely steps in to save people from their own mistakes, or people who just sit back and expect to be rescued. Far more common is for Him to enable/empower good people who are already trying to help to accomplish more than is considered humanly possible. Was that the case in this incident? I have no idea.

Anonymous said...

Well put, Jos Metadi! I too, as most of us, have seen bad things happen to good people and vice versa, but God is in conrol and who can know His ways?

Perry de Havilland said...

It was a well designed aircraft, a truly stupendous pilot, damn good co-pilot, good cabin crew and a commendably calm bunch of passengers who had ample opportunity to kill themselves regardless by panicking and yet declined to do so. Why denigrate those things by attributing this to the supernatural?

They also got lucky (daylight, clam river to land in) but the fact is they *all* saved themselves by acting rationally. It was one of those "proud to be human" moments that so rarely come along.

The Whited Sepulchre said...

Perry De Havilland, the genius behind Samizdata, now dwells among us.

Take off your shoes, for you are now standing on Holy Ground.

Perry de Havilland said...


The Whited Sepulchre said...

Yeah, well, if God doesn't ever intervene, I guess there's no hope of this site EVER being blogrolled by Samizdata.

(Heavy, heavy sigh....)

Cedric Katesby said...

Only somebody with rocks in their head would credit an invisible sky daddy for rescuing the passengers on the plane.

No "miracle" is needed.

The next time the media reports a plane crash and all 232 passengers die a burning, screaming, agonizing death...what are you going to do?
Blame the sky daddy?
Or maybe you'll just put it down to an air traffic controller drinking on the job?
What sounds more logical to you?
Think about it.
If the sky daddy gets let off the hook when something nasty happens then why does the sky daddy get the credit when something "nice" happens?
If god wanted to protect those passengers, then why not avoid the melodrama altogether and just alter the flight-path of the geese by a few metres?
Here's a video for all the fuzzy-headed people out there...
Next time some clown trys to sell you the "It's a miracle" line, tell them to get a life.

Fearnot said...

Many people will never see the miracles of God, for They are not meant to see, that there is a Sovereign God who will always look out for those whom He foreknew.

Via Domus said...

Religious people are seriously retarded, heres something that may help "GET YOUR HEADS OUT OF YOUR ASSES AND SMELL THE COFFEE" and by Coffee i mean reality, I do not mean to be a bit vulgar... oh wait Never mind thats what this is intended for.
I am not an atheist, I am Buddhist. I try to be more of a realist as it only makes sense that you see the reality that not some fairytale entity that saves people, because if this was true, it is a very choosy being, so basically a dick.